BUSRAGE Discussions » Rants
Aircoach versus Taxi's
(22 posts)-
As a new driver for Aircoach, it has come to my attention the number of Taxi Drivers that attempt to "poach" our passengers at bus stops. On more than one occasion this week i had passengers complaining that a Taxi had stopped and the driver saying Aircoach wasnt running that day. Other complaints of how Taxi's have evn told some passengers that particular stops werent in use and i even caught one red-handed the other day at O'Connell Street. The passenger he was speaking to informed me that apparently he said our fares had gone up to 15EUR each way and returns werent offered anymore. Needless to say, his licence number was taken and complaint sent to the Carriage Office!Posted 4 years ago #
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Ah here Bud....
Have you no symapthy for the poor oul taxi man.....
For quite some time now I have quarrelled with several Media organs concerning their description of Aircoach as an Airport BUS service.
I have also attempted to remind many contributors to such Programmes/Journals that Aircoach is not really a competitor for Bus Atha Cliath at all.
The reality is that (Save for the Social Welfare Twirlies) Aircoach customers are in the main Taxi Types who would rarely use "Ordinary" Public Bus services in their home environment and see a certain cachet in the Luxury Coach service offered by John O.
This definition of the market segment was noticed from Day one by Dublins Finest and ever since I have watched their "Poaching" with interest and glee as it is usually unsuccessful.
Good to see a poster from within the Acoach ranks as there is a veil of secrecy over the companys operations......Posted 4 years ago # -
Veil of secrecy? Ask away and i will reveal all.
Drivers come and go. Average 20 buses in operation during the day (if they havent gone tech). Very strict Revenue. If caught with fingers in pocket; sacked on the spot. Many of the drivers are foreign. Mainly South African for some reason. The best pay in Ireland per hour basis. 12eur for first 6months, 13 after that, 14 after 1yr, 15EUR after 18months. No conditions or facilities. No breaks. Just turn up and drive off. simple. Many dont stick it but for me i dont mind being on the road and i am fairly chilled no matter what traffic conditions. Average 11 to 12hours a day for 5days a week. More if you wish. So take home pay can equal A LOT of money if you want it. Passengers are fairly decent tho many complain about the wait! 15-20mins????? mostly tourists and business men. Some of them twats. Just recently also airport staff are becoming increasingly annoying by flagging us down at unauthrised stops. Not only illegal but irritating when fighting to make progress first thing in the morning. I also recently had a conv with a taxi driver at the airport. He said many airport staff that live in swords are using aircoach on fri/sat nites out on the town and getting bus to airport, then a taxi home from there to swords. This obviously displeases them.
Any further questions/comments?
[posted by: Aircoach man]Posted 4 years ago # -
Just some observations.
Its surprising how big the turnover level is.
I know most of the "Shiny Arses" to see and a handful are left from the original startup drivers.
Possibly the biggest issue for the "Big Money" drivers is going to be the 48Hr week which is looking increasingly likely to be enforced from next March.
By my reckoning this piece of beauracratic nonsense will really hit ANY big earners in the Bus Driving world.
Have any of your colleagues considered the effects of being forcibly limited to an AVERAGE of 48 hrs per week over an 11 week cycle.
The other issue is the "No Breaks" bit.
How can this be ?
AFAIK the law obliges an employer to afford break time and I understand this has to away from the place of work.
In the drivers case it must be off the vehicle.
Just some discussion points but certainly worth bearing in mind given the bloody imminence of the "Working Time Directive"...Grrrrrrrrrr !Posted 4 years ago # -
To be honest i dont know much about the laws you quote although i do have experience of EEC Tach hours and rules. I do not see how any democratic state can "force" employees and employers to do anything, let alone work under a certain length of time. Perhaps in the days of Franco or Stalin, but definately not in an EEC State. Are the laws you state particular to Ireland? I know the UK has domestic rules which can be used for journeys of aprox 30miles from depot or less over a regular scheduled route.
As for the breaks bit. Again i am not sure how this works. As i say i know the tacho rules and like you say, Rest period cannot be taken on the vehicle unless it is fitted with a Drivers Bunk. There must be an explanation otherwise i am sure many a disgruntled driver would have taken legal action by now. Some time ago a group of collegues attempted to club together and join a union. Ultimately, O'Sul gave them an ultimatum and they backed down.
At the end of the day, in fairness to Aircoach, at the interview they put the cards on the table and if you dont like what you hear, then why join the company? I am by no means a kiss arse. In fact i tend to keep myself to myself, but the one thing for sure is that by working at Aircoach you can make a huge amount of money if you want. It all depends on what you are after. a 39 hour week with Roster in advance, drivers rest area and canteen etc or money.
[posted by: Aircoach man]Posted 4 years ago # -
Air Man,This is an issue which is VERY much a threat to us all in this business.
The new regulation which is dressed up under the title of the "Reorganization of working time directive" has been in effect since the late 1990`s for most categories EXCEPT public transport.
One of the reasons we had been exempt was the extremely high overtime levels worked throughout Europe in Public Transport.
Essentially the overtime availibility was something which compensated for the very strong disincentive of the rolling shifts which we all are familiar with.
The present directive MUST be put into effect in our domestic regulations by March 2005.
The information now coming slowly through the grapevine reveals that the 48 hours will be policed by the Dept of Transport.
Those found to be infringing it,BOTH employer and employee are liable to fines of up to 1300 euro.
BAC are presently recruiting up to 300 extra drivers merely to cater for the huge extra workload which is presently covered by Overtime,both rostered and unrostered.
As our standard working week is presently 39 hours this allocates each driver a mere 9 hours per week as overtime.
In other words a single rest day OR approx 2 hours daily .
VERY few of our drivers are aware of exactly how much money they will lose thanks to the imposition of a whim written on the PC of some desk bound expert in Brussels.
The entire rotten process is being accompanied by a touchy-feely EU sponsored programme known as the Work-Life Balance programme.
This consists of Companies taking part in surveys to reassure the deskbound one that their employees are not working to hard or for too long.
Basically it is a lazy boy`s charter as it seeks to ridicule and reduce the role played by those who actually DO like the job they perform and who do not necessarily buy into the happy clappy family Values thing so beloved of the Liberal Trinity Graduate elite.
The laws are EU wide and are contained in the form of Directives which must be transcribed into domestic regulations.
The 50KM dispensation for stage carriage work is now largely at an end and eventually with the introduction of the next phase of Electronic Tacho will allow the new hours regs to be automatically incorporated into each drivers personal identity module,which will inserted into the vehicles tacho and then downloaded back at base.
The net effect of this of course will be to automate the entire recording and tracking process and to make damn sure that you and I as mere Busdrivers dont get too fond of Taking two holidays a year or for that matter aspiring to better oneself at all.
Croppy lie down would be a better description.Posted 4 years ago # -
Sorry i may have read this incorrectly but "Aircoach Man", did you say you drive for 11-12 hours straight with no break? Forgetting about the laws (which you are breaking) how anybody can get behind the wheel for this many hours really shocks me, can i ask how you would feel if after 9 hours you were involved in a serious accident and it was dicovered you had been driving for that amount of time, i can tell you every newspaper would be so quick to highlight the illegal work practices of Aircoach.
Sorry but you really annoy me - with the amount of road accidents happening in this country it sickens me how you can sit behind the wheel of a bus for 12 hours without a proper break - do you have a conscience?
do you understand how much of a threat you are to other road users?
[posted by: P]Posted 4 years ago # -
Hi "p".
Your comment isnt even worthy of comment. You want me to give up my job because you are not happy with me?
Christ, when i worked in the UK as a ski tour driver, we would be on duty double manned for upto 22hours at a time. Have you ever driven to Val D'serre non stop?
Please make a sensible comment or dont bother at all.
To be quite frank, i couldnt give a monkeys what you think of me. You are obviously a bit of a prick yourself for even making a comment like that.
Incidently, as you obviously not in the industry i suggest you check out EU laws. Under those, 9 hours driving a day is allowed anyway, stretched to 10 twice per week for upto 12days continuous work and then with only 2 1/2days off.
If you are unhappy about this then i suggest you also go on Hunger Strike outside the Dail.
And as for us being a threat to other roadusers. Well, what can i say? that makes me laugh. Are you another head shaking, finger gestulating private car driver that shouts abuse and fights for the last inch at the exit of bus lanes? You are obviously such a moral, good-doing advanced motorist. Perhaps you should see if you could do better at the helm of 40' with 55 back seat passengers.
Oh and one last thing, why dont you write what you wrote above, to the Newspapers?
[posted by: Aircoach Man]Posted 4 years ago # -
I am sorry "P"
I know i did say i would make comment, but just one last thing........
Can you tell us all on BusRage just how many incidents/accidents there have been within Ireland, UK and perhaps even the whole of the EU, involving buses of more than 17seats?
Out of the those, how many were down to drivers fatigue.
Compare those to the amount of drink drivers, young drivers and people probably much like yourself that have been killed of indeed have killed.
I think i have made my point.
[posted by: Aircoach Man]Posted 4 years ago # -
Well Aircoach man, thats quite a response...
"Your comment isnt even worthy of comment. You want me to give up my job because you are not happy with me? "
Can you please tell me where is suggested you give up your job?
"Please make a sensible comment or dont bother at all. "
Sorry but whether you like it or not, i do have an opinion and i will comment on whatever topic I wish.
"To be quite frank, i couldnt give a monkeys what you think of me. You are obviously a bit of a prick yourself for even making a comment like that. "
What was that you said about sensible comments????
As for the laws may i suggest you check up on them - driving a bus 12 hours straight IS ILLEGAL
· The daily driving period should not exceed nine hours. However, it may be extended twice in any one week to 10 hours.
· A weekly rest period is prescribed after six daily driving periods, and in international non-regular carriage of passengers, after 12 daily driving periods.
· The total driving period is one fortnight or a maximum of 90 hours.
· A break of at least 45 minutes is required after four-and-a-half hours of continuous driving. In certain Member States, passenger transport drivers are limited to 30-minute breaks after four hours of driving.
With regard to accidents you should know that to be involved in an accident need not be your fault but should an investigation arise you can be sure your working pattern will be questioned. I could give you a list of crashes involving tirdeness but here's a few statistics for you - 10% of road accidents are linked to falling asleep and in 2001 in the UK, sleepy drivers killed 300 people. (survey carried out by uk government in 2002).
However this is not about whether drink driving or young drivers kill more than fatigue, the fact is driving for 12 hours is dangerous - if you try to tell me otherwise you are only fooling yourself.
My initial post was'nt written to turn into a slagging match as you did but i am genuinely shocked that Aircoach allow their drivers to drive under their own laws.
[posted by: P]Posted 4 years ago # -
ok Fair enough. Thanks for your opinion.
A lot of people seemed to be concerned about the Aircoach practises and to be honest i do not know how they get away with it. Perhaps, like others i just assume they must be exploiting some loophole as surely if they were illegal, someone by now would have dragged them through the papers.
As for myself, well i have a family to support and as i am the only one working, i just turn up, do the job and then go home again. Looking at my recent payslips, i have been working an average of 9.7hours a day stretched over a week.
As i said above, it seems to me that a lot of people get concerned with Aircoach. I do not know why this is. Maybe they are "genuinly" concerned, although i doubt this. I think its perhaps more like sour grapes or something to do with thier visible success as a profit earner.
I am not going to start "being difficult" at work nor attempt to start a Union or any kind of uprising for that matter. I have done all that before in other jobs and it achieves nothing in the end but self hardship.
My message to the many people that do not like Aircoach is to write or call John O'Sullivan on 01 8447118. @ Aircoach, Airport Business Park, Dublin Airport.
Kind Regards
[posted by: Aircoach Man]Posted 4 years ago # -
Aircoachman.
I too have seen taxis poaching customers, from both Aircoach and Dublin Bus Airlink service.
However, there is one taxi-driver who won't be doing it again . . .
One morning I was waiting for an Airlink at the stop in O'Connell Street when a taxi pulled in, and told me that there were no Airlinks at that hour of the morning (6.30). I told him he was wrong.
Then he told me they weren't running today. Again I told him he was wrong.
He wouldn't take no for an answer, and said to me that he would take me to the Airport for the same as I would pay on the Airlink.
I asked him if he was sure he would take me to the airport for the same amount that I would have to pay on the bus, and he said yes.
So I climbed in and let him take me there.
On arrival I showed him my Rambler ticket . . .
He was incandescent with rage, but when I asked him to get a Garda, and started taking photographs of his vehicle he screeched off in a bit of a hurry . . .
SoS
[posted by: Steve O'Shea]Posted 4 years ago # -
I assume you showed the Rambler ticket to say "I wouldn't have to pay anything on the Airlink bus".
If so, the taxi driver obviously doesn't realise that the Rambler ticket doesn't apply on Airlink (or Nitelink or Tours).
http://www.dublinbus.ie/fares_and_tickets/daily.asp
You might consider reporting the driver to the Carriage Office. They are slow but do eventually respond.Posted 4 years ago # -
Rambler tickets are now usable on Airlink's.From the link you posted:-
Validity? Unlimited Travel for one, three, five or seven consecutive days for one adult on all Dublin Bus services INCLUDING the Airlink service but excluding Nitelink, Ferry services & Tours.
[posted by: graham]Posted 4 years ago # -
Mr Smarty Pants...!!!!Posted 4 years ago #
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I stand corrected. I read the 'Tavel 90' restrictions.Posted 4 years ago #
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I had to double check meself cos I've been telling my passengers that they're not valid on Airlink for ages now so I'm corrected too!
[posted by: Graham]Posted 4 years ago # -
to be honest the airocoach is excellent for the moment, and i'd rather go in the aircoach than in the taxi any time!
[posted by: charlie]Posted 4 years ago # -
"I had to double check meself cos I've been telling my passengers that they're not valid on Airlink for ages now so I'm corrected too!"
There's a picture of an Airlink bus on the front of the ticket!
[posted by: P]Posted 4 years ago # -
"There's a picture of an Airlink bus on the front of the ticket!"
Not on any Rambler ticket I've ever seen.No picture's on any of them.When I first started in the job I read the back of one which stated it wasn't valid on Airlink,somebody changed that and forgot to tell the troops.
[posted by: Graham]Posted 4 years ago # -
Troops were indeed informed by a couple of memo`s and a none too clear depot notice......But hey ....Now we have the plasma screen`s...!!!Posted 4 years ago #
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Not in my depot.I was never big on reading anyway,I like telly though so shouldn't miss any more!
[posted by: Graham]Posted 4 years ago #
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