I was just wondering that. It seems to me that part of the route, between Chancery Lane (jct. Church Street Lower) and Smithfield will be a tracks-only affair.
Now…what with the masses of traffic on the Liffey Quays, would it not be prudent to turn the Line A route between Connolly Station and Heuston Bridge into Dublin’s first city-centre busway? or is that too forward-thinking.
Cities like Calgary, Canada have streets dedicated to buses and LRT only (like 5th Street in that particular town mentioned) with local delivery access permitted of course, but no cars or other vehicles permitted whatsoever excepting emergency vehicles—and no taxicabs!
Sounds too good to be true, I suppose…sharing a paved dedicated Luas route on the bus, by-passing all the gobs of traffic on the quays, then getting on Parkgate Street’s bus lanes or St. John’s Road West bus lanes and speeding right home on the ould bus…
Mind you, I would be completely against this for Line B though…mainly because it would hurt the potential for high-volume and higher-speed rail running on that line…
Any thoughts on this?
BUSRAGE Discussions » Buslanes and QBCs
Luas Line A route in City Centre paved? Possible Busway?
(11 posts)-
Posted 4 years ago #
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Al, what a good idea. The only problem with that idea though is that the buses then will have to reduce their speed in a built up are to match those of the trams, which I doubt will be allowed to travel at more than 4 miles per hour (walking speed) for Irish pedestrian safety reasons. If you doubt what I say just take a look at any set of traffic lights that allows pedestrians to cross only when ALL the traffic is stopped.
On the European continent, USA and Australia, road traffic can proceed to make turns when pedestrians have green, provided the crossing is clear. In Ireland no road user can be trusted to follow rules of the road unless they are regulated to do so by a red light. The analogy here is that the tram will not be allowed to proceed at more than waking pace in case a pedestrian gets in the way.Posted 4 years ago # -
To be utterly frank, I do not think that people would ride the trams if they were restricted to walking speed. In other places where you have streets relegated as dedicated tramways/busways, the footpath/sidewalk is fenced off to prevent pedestrian trespass.
Besides, there ought not be a bias against trams when cars, buses and trucks are not themselves restricted to 4 mph, don’t you agree…? A busway for the quite populated corridors west would certainly help with the traffic madness in Dublin’s city centre, to be sure…Posted 4 years ago # -
Where on earth did you get the walking speed idea from? I've heard some cracked ideas made up by the Luas bashers but this takes the biscuit. Have you ever been in Brussels, Manchester or anywhere else in Europe that has trams?
The only consolation is that the black propaganda against Luas isn't dissimilar to the black propaganda that was flung at DART when it was under construction. Nobody remembers that now for some reason.
[posted by: Con]Posted 4 years ago # -
Let's see what happens when the LUAS is cranked up.
Foreign nationalities have a different outlook on traffic safety and individuals are trusted not to get in the way. As I said, just look at the different pedestrian crossing system used in Europe, USA and Australia, where traffic can proceed despite a green crossing for pedestrians, provided the crossing is clear. That would never work in an Irish mentality. More people than ever would be killed at pedestrian crossings here.
That's also the reason why trams will proceed slowly in the city centre, for "pedestrian safety reasons" and because as a nation we can't be trusted to obey rules.
The trams work in Brussels because the streets in Brussels are nice and wide to take trams, which incidentally, also go underground and which are augmented by a comprehensive rail and metro network within the city.
As far as black propaganda is concerned, the LUAS will do no good for me as I wait for the an improvement in the 39 service to Blanchardstown. The nearest LUAS to that will be in Blackhall Place! My only hope is that passengers on the LUAS routes will use the trams instead of the buses and thereby free up buses and drivers to improve the bus service to Blanchardstown and Clonsilla.
Also, the DART goes nowhere near Clonsilla, a line which has not been electrified. It still remains a mystery to me how a relatively empty stretch of railway line from Howth Junction to Malahide was electrified while the much larger population area along the Maynooth line was left to endure increasing population and the same train "service" that existed 20 years ago.
LUAS my foot!Posted 4 years ago # -
Ah Go on outa dat RS....this harks back to the original DART "Debate" in the lead up to the electrification of the Howth/Bray line.
The Electrification of Howth/Bray may well yet be said to have stifled further expansion of commuter rail services in Dublin for the best part of a century.
The decision to Electrify rather than upgrade the pre-existing line with Diesel Multiple Units ensured that CIE were faced with a truly enormous capital programme,the funding of which at the last moment was substantially altered and which continues to impose a serious penalty on all of the Republics taxbase.
In return for this not a single extra population centre was added to the list of stations served by the Howth/Bray line.
Meanwhile the remainder of Dublins rapidly expanding hinterland was left to flounder in a mire of Non-Management.
The fact remains that the extent of this semi-criminal lack of accountability is only beginning to seep into the public domain.
The Howth/Bray electrification project was an opportunity for a generation of engineering profesionals to accquire and use the latest in CAD and Electro Engineering technology a scenario which was repeated in another sphere twenty years later with the advent of LUAS.
It really is beginning to look as if the Irish as a race came off second best out of this Independence thing...Posted 4 years ago # -
Proves my point really. Those who perceive that a project will be detrimental to their interests will protest and a good example of the "it doesnt serve me so I'll dump on it" was when Shiela Terry, county councillor for west Dublin objected to Luas Line A at the public enquiry because it didnt serve Blanchardstown.
Ah sure, Buses are good enough for us.
[posted by: Con]Posted 4 years ago # -
Ah lads.....Sheila Terry is a POLITITIAN and posesses about as much credibility as a Chocolate Orange so puhleeeeze give over with raising our expectations in this matter.
And dont forget that oul Mr Brennan and his Bakers are still persevering with his 25% franchising scenario.
His most recent statement was to castigate CIE Staff for their Intransiegence in not allowing his cuddly multi-national pals access to their rightful slice of the Irish Pudding.
Remember the by-line of Seamus Og`s 25% plan is "NOT A SINGLE EXTRA BUS ON THE CITY`S STREETS"...Now theres progress for ye...!Posted 4 years ago # -
Well put Alec, in relation both to the electrocution of the rail lines, and the plans for the privateering of Dublin's bus service.
I reckon that these pages show more evidence of thought, discussion and planning than the official "PLANNERS" could ever display by their results.
The Irish didn't invent public transport and we certainly don't need to reinvent the concept. All our "planners" have to do to ensure that the "FUTURE" is catered for is to simply look at transportation systems in capital cities on continental Europe and copy them.
Can you imagine what the bridge builders in Dublin in the 18th and 19th centuries were thinking of when they built all those bridges to take horses and carts? Look at them now, able to take the broad range, weights and volume of modern vehicular traffic. That was planning for the future.
We only seem to be able to plan for the present, which isn't planning at all. We have come a long way in the last 200 years, haven't we?Posted 4 years ago # -
Blame the Lemass government. Tod was put in as official hatchet man for a country with a dwindling population that couldn't or wouldn't afford a public transport system that used anything other than buses.
Add successive governments in hock to suppliers of road materials and sellers of cars and petrol, and what do you get? A two-hour journey home.
Flippin' wonderful country we live in.
[posted by: Con]Posted 4 years ago # -
when will they get to corduff/cappagh/north rd
[posted by: barry williams]Posted 4 years ago #
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